Episode 615: Women in Dentistry: From Practice to Podium

Start speaking at smaller groups, 15 to 20 people in study groups, and you sort of hone your
material. I always liken it to being like a comedian that goes out into the comedy clubs and they
try their material and they get comfortable on stage and they figure out what works visually for
them. Welcome to the Phil Klein Dental Podcast. In addition to her successful dental practice in
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, Dr. Susan McMahon has embraced a leadership role as one of the most
sought-after speakers in the dental profession. And with her success, she is a strong advocate for
women dentists to take center stage in their field. In this episode, we'll talk about how women can
make their way to the podium and balance their career between being a clinician and an educator.
Dr. McMahon will be joining us in a moment, but first... We all know that to achieve healthy,
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Dr. McMahon, thanks for joining us on our show. Hello, Phil. So nice to be here again. Yes, we
really appreciate your input. And you've done so much great work with Viva Learning over the years,
webinars, podcasts. We've written blogs about things you've talked about and some really good
insight. And I know that you continue to practice in a very high-end way, which really is
important to us because we love hearing about how you do things as a successful. dentist who has
great values as far as conservative dentistry and everything else, which is so important to our
profession. So this is an interesting topic. We're talking about dentistry in terms of
demographics, men and women. Now, in the old days, the graduating class of a dental school might
have been, I don't know, 15, 20% women, 80% men. That's completely changed and actually flipped
where there are more women graduating dental school. And as far as I know, at least from my alma
mater, which is Penn, I think the graduating class of 2025 is going to be 53% women.
So it's more women than men. But there's still a gap in the way dentistry is represented as far as
on the podium, as mentioned in this title. So statistically, dentistry has been changing toward a
more balanced distribution, men and women. What are the numbers? Give us an idea of what those
numbers are. Yeah, my dental school class was like your dental school class. We were 16% women in
my dental school class. And I'm not going to say what year that was because then I'd have to kill
you. These days, it's taken us a little while, right?
There are more women graduating from dental school than men these days. You know, I think we're
hedging, we're getting closer and closer to the 55% mark of graduating, you know,
women graduating from dental school than men. And I think that, you know, that has a lot to do
with. Just professional school in general has swayed toward more women over the years and
undergraduates have as well. The numbers have risen in undergraduates toward more women graduating
than men as well. But in dentistry, we've, you know, we sort of are lagging behind a little bit. So
even though 53% of women graduating from dental school. or graduating classes are women these
days, still only out there in the practicing world. I think the numbers are right around 35 to 37%
of practicing dentists are women these days. But if you look at the under 40 range,
the dentists who are under 40 years old, we are 50 to 55% of practicing dentists.
Our numbers are growing and it's been great that it's changed during my career.
I'd never thought that would happen. I didn't think it would happen so quickly. And I've been
really happy to be, to try to do my part to help more women get to the podium and get to leadership
positions. So what do you think has driven the change in demographics where women are now
graduating at a higher rate than men? What's changed that since we graduate dental school? Well, I
think in general, more and more women are seeking out professional degrees. And dentistry is such
an incredible career for women in that you can have decent working hours,
you can still, you know, be married, have children, and keep growing your professional career.
And I think that we're seeing that reflected in the number of applicants to dental school and the
number of graduates. Yeah, I think it's fantastic that that's happening. And how would dentists
begin if they want to become a speaker? So if I'm a woman dentist and I'm out there for a few years
and I want to balance my career with more education, a little bit more,
add a little education into my balance where I'm actually the educator versus being the consumer of
the education, going to a CE course, et cetera. How do I do that? How do I make that move?
People ask me this all the time. So I think it's important to know why you want to be a speaker.
You know, for me, I started speaking when my youngest child, the first time I spoke,
my youngest child was three months old. And I bought the ILT Bright Smile whitening system.
I don't know if you remember that. Yeah, I do. I do. And someone asked me to come and speak at a
laser medicine meeting about my experience with a laser whitener. Laser whitening system.
I remember I was so nervous. I had the crappiest slides you can imagine. It was just,
it was not, it was not my finest hour. I can tell you that. But what it did for me was it made me
realize that I would be a much better dentist if I were out there speaking, because you really have
to know your material. And I was also passionate about sharing some of the things that I was doing.
It's necessary to photograph your work and to be really well-versed. on the things that you're
passionate about. And then if you want to become a speaker, you kind of have to develop a point of
view as to what you want to talk about. And you have to develop some relationships with people that
have groups that... need speakers. So, and that's not terribly difficult to do because there's lots
of groups out there that are looking for people to come and speak. And I started small,
although I spoke the first, that first group I spoke to was probably 300 people in a packed room,
which only made me more nervous. But, you know, you start speaking at smaller groups,
15 to 20 people in study groups, and you sort of hone your material. I always liken it to being
like a comedian that goes out into the comedy clubs. and they try their material and they get
comfortable on stage and they figure out what works visually for them. And we sort of have to do
the same thing as dental speakers. We want to make sure our material is... relevant, that we're
passionate about whatever we're talking about, that we are really well-versed, you know, that we
are absolutely expert on whatever we're talking about, because that's the only reason to get up in
front of a room to share with other people is to maybe to give them something that they wouldn't
know otherwise. And I think delivery is really important, too. So I think that,
you know, I've done a lot of speaker training over the years, too, to hone my skills and to get
better and better, I hope. Yeah. Tell us about that. What kind of speaker training have you
undergone and where does one go for that? And what have you learned? Oh, I've learned so much from
speaker training. So there's lots of options for it. I most recently was... got some from a group
called Eloquii. And it was part of a program called the Guiding Leaders,
which is a women's development program that Glidewell puts on. And they take 25 women a year.
and give them sort of training across the board on executive training. But also there's a segment
on speaker training. And this was probably the best one I ever did. It was with a couple.
The woman was a casting director and the man was an actor. And they really helped give me stage
presence, talk about stage presence and things that we as dentists don't normally talk about. You
know, when that speaker gets up there, slide, click, slide, click, slide, click. And three minutes
in, you're like, how am I going to make it through the end of this lecture? How am I going to stay
awake? Learning sort of from other industries has been very helpful. How to tell a story,
how to organize your material so it's sequential. And at the same time,
it's compelling to stay. And what you finish, you know, you have a great beginning and a great end.
And your meat of your material in the middle is important. And that takes a little bit of time to
develop that. but there's people that can help you with that. Like I mentor a number of women
dentists who are emerging speakers. And I do that through personally,
just through personal contacts. And then I work with the Mommy Dentists in Business, the group of
women who... mothers, dentists, business owners, and we have a little speakers program going there.
And a couple of times a year, I will give a full day seminar on speaking and kind of how to develop
a program, what your slides should look like. And then the people that are in that program will
help, will look at their slides and say, here's how I think you can make this better, you know,
pictures better, content better, formatting better, that sort of thing. So out of the individuals
that you've met, the women that you've met that are in in building their speaking career, what's
their main objective? I know there's probably not one objective, but what are their top two or
three main objectives? Why they would give up clinical time, where they can certainly make more
money, I would assume, than speaking, unless you're a one-of-a-kind speaker who gets this
incredible rate. But especially in the beginning, what do you think is driving some of these
individuals? I think it's the same thing that drives men to be on the podium is, you know,
there's a little bit of feeling of like they love the camaraderie of being in a group like that.
I think they also love the for me, it was every time I photographed my work and I started doing
that. as I went through the AACD accreditation process. And then I started to build this body of
cases that I could tap into for my lectures. But every time you photograph your work and you put it
on a screen, a huge screen in front of people, you... become a better dentist.
Because you look at your work and you think, how can I make that better? So it's a constant self
-improvement situation for us too. And some of us just enjoy being up there in the limelight.
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products at bisco.com. So what about the balance of the career,
of the dental career, where you're not only in the operatory? The aspect of being out,
like you said, with your colleagues and sharing cases and being relevant with them and getting
respect from them and you respecting their work, how does that make your life more enriched by
doing this? Yeah, I agree. I think enriched is the exact word it is. It makes you, it gives you a
more varied career. So I love my clinical work. I love to be in my office,
but I also really enjoy being out there at the meetings. I love getting to know the people in the
industry. I personally really like to know the science behind a lot of our products.
And when you're in your office, You don't necessarily get exposed to those sorts of things. You can
read journals and you can, but you don't have the interaction that you have with all of your
colleagues that you get when you're out there lecturing or, you know, presenting at meetings or
going to, you know. companies will take us to their manufacturing sites and introduce us to the
scientists and show us how products get developed. And I just find that really interesting.
And I think, I just feel it makes me such a better dentist all the way around. Yeah. And does it
give you the opportunity to test materials that are coming out in equipment to be an evaluator for
these companies and giving them the feedback along the way? It absolutely does. And then I feel
like it helps because of... given the opportunity to give feedback, we can actually help drive
products into ways that are completely useful to us. I find that really fulfilling as well.
Yeah. And it's also a practice builder. I mean, your patients should learn about the fact that
you're speaking and teaching other dentists. You can have photos. Maybe you're on a cover of a
magazine, maybe not. Maybe you're just writing an article in a magazine and those can be framed and
put in the waiting room. I don't know. Is that something that you could do to also help? build your
practice and the perception of your knowledge and capabilities with your patients? Patients really
appreciate it. And patients are, I definitely find patients seek me out because of that.
And because of, you know, I lecture and I've been on a couple of the magazine covers. I always
joke, I wanted to be on the, you know, Sports Illustrated swimsuit. Turns out it was dentistry
today, which thank you, Paul Puristein. I really appreciate that.
Yeah, Paul's a good guy. He's the technology guy. Yeah, I saw him at the recent New York show.
Very, very cool guy. And an advocate for women too, which is amazing. Yeah, he's a great guy.
But sure, we definitely promote that. It's on my website. It's on our social media.
Whenever I write an article or even these podcasts, we'll promote on our social media because it
lets our patients know that I'm out there. I'm engaged in whatever the newest technology is that
I'm helping to drive dentistry forward and that I'm certainly knowledgeable of all the new
techniques. Yeah, I thought it was very interesting when you made a comparison to the comedian who
goes out there to the small club, throws a few jokes out there, sees what sticks, what makes people
laugh, and then he knows to embellish those jokes or keep working along that path of humor,
knowing that it's working with a smaller crowd. And then as they get up to the big Netflix event,
they certainly are going to use the jokes that have been proven tried and true from the past.
What has actually... you in the past when you do your dental presentations where people,
where the audience reacted to it the most, where you realized I need to keep nurturing this concept
because it seems to be holding the interest of the crowd and I'm getting a good reaction out of
them. Right. But that's exactly how we work to figure it out. So there are things that I love to
speak about that I'm just passionate about and like conservative cosmetics for younger people.
That's my favorite topic to talk about. I have a lot of. clinical cases. I show doctors how to
retain the patients in their office, how to talk to them about it. And I'll go through case by case
by case. And for me, that's, that's helpful. Like I want to give a program that people learn from
all day long, as opposed to a program that you might pick just one or two things out of.
So I try to, I'm a clinician. So that's what I talk about clinical cases, but You know,
I don't talk a whole lot about cementing during my lectures anymore because it is so dull and
there's nothing I can do to make that more exciting. There's like I can't put any passion in that
when I talk about it. So I don't talk a whole lot about that anymore. I focus on the things that
are more engaging for the audience. the engaging the staff, how to talk to the patients about it.
Those are the things that they don't necessarily get from reading a journal. You can read a journal
and figure out how to do cementation, but you can't necessarily read a journal and figure out how
to tap into your patient's emotions and make sure that you're being mindful of that and how your
team can come and support you with that and how you can. Take several different procedures and kind
of bundle them together to get a good outcome. That's still really conservative. It seems to me
you're the kind of person who Evaluates your own work in terms of you being in the audience
watching the presentation and saying what would I be bored of? What would I start to get antsy
about and start to move around in my chair and start looking at my phone? And then you kind of cut
those things out of your presentation. So you're aware of what of how your audience is going to
react to the things that you're presenting, and you pick and choose what you want to hear. Is that,
am I correct there? That's exactly right. Building my presentation in a way that I think gives,
would give me something useful to take back to the office. And your approach, of course, fits into
why many dentists go to these CE courses in the first place. I mean, I know they need to get their
CE credit, but in addition, they certainly want to be able to take something back to their office
that they can put to use. That's practical and that they could benefit from the practice and their
patients. I think it's been a great discussion, Dr. McMahon. And as we wrap up this podcast, any
closing thoughts? Yeah, I just wanted to say a few more things about, you know, how we can see more
women on the podium and in leadership and especially on the podium. And I think that what's really
powerful is that. when women are on the podium,
that we're supporting them. And by supporting them, I mean filling out the evaluations for the
sponsors that have put them up there and for the meetings that have put them up there, and that we
are supporting the companies that support women. And there's lots of companies out there that are
supporting women on the podium. And if we have choices, and we do every time we purchase something,
and we need to purchase things as dentists, that we are purchasing things from these companies that
are supporting more women on the podium. And you'll be able to tell, you know, every meeting has
who's sponsoring which lectures. And when we have the options and when we're thinking about buying,
let's buy from the companies that are putting women up there on those podiums. Dr. McMahon,
another excellent podcast. Thank you so much for your insight. We look forward to having you on
more programs. And for those of you who want to hear... that Dr. McMahon has done with Viva
Learning. Just go to vivalearning.com, type in McMahon, M-C-M-A-H-O-N,
and you'll find all of our stuff. Thank you again, Dr. McMahon. We really appreciate it. Thank you
so much for having me. I appreciate it. If you're enjoying this podcast, please leave a review or
follow us on your favorite podcast platform. It's a great way to support our program and spread the
word to others. Thanks so much for listening. See you in the next episode.